garys_2k
join:2004-05-07
Farmington, MI
 ·Future Nine Corpor..
·Vonage
| Five Years and Out
I just passed my fifth Vonage anniversary by a week and my port out of Vonage was just completed yesterday.
The good: Reliability, call quality (most of the time) and ease of setup. It's easy for a complete newcomer to VOIP to use (but see "ugly," below).
The mediocre: Feature list, some are excellent but others just aren't there.
The bad: Price -- poor value compared to the market. Vonage is priced below POTS but just about at the price point of cable VOIP -- no incentive to roll the dice beyond the cable co. They are downright uncompetitive with the rest of the VOIP market, too.
That, plus the lack of BYOD and SIP peering. You can't use Vonage with Voxalot, mysipswitch or other call routing services.
The ugly: Their TOS -- it is awful for newer customers! Luckily I signed up long enough ago to not have been under the early cancellation rules, but for anyone thinking of signing up now, WATCH OUT! Expect to lose over a $100 if you cancel even one day past 30 days (clock starts when they activate your account, NOT when you get the device!), even if you're constantly on the phone with CSRs trying to straighten out problems and make the service work.
I'm also afraid that their constant negative cash flow will cause them to go under, but people have been pounding nails in their coffin for years. Still, financial gravity cannot be defied forever. If they don't start making money, and soon, there will be a lot of very unhappy people.
So, farewell Vonage. My Motorola VT-1005 is headed for the recycle center for a long rest. |
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WAVZuser
join:2006-08-19
| I admire your courage. You're giving up reliability. You're going to wade into the waters and try something new. Whichever company you're going to, you probably know relatively little about its reliability as compared to Vonage, and absolutely nothing about its finances or how many customers it has, but you're going to take the plunge anyway.
I guess Vonage got too boring for you, so you need adventure.
I hope it works out for you. Please keep us updated. |
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strange_69
join:2001-08-07
Ridgecrest, CA | reply to garys_2k
I'm going to miss you Gary. Please IM me and let me know what you find out. I'm staying but I need a back up for when that day comes. Thanks, Steve
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Vonage user since Mar 2004. |
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garys_2k
join:2004-05-07
Farmington, MI
·Future Nine Corpor..
·Vonage
| reply to WAVZuser
said by WAVZuser  :I admire your courage. You're giving up reliability. You're going to wade into the waters and try something new. Whichever company you're going to, you probably know relatively little about its reliability as compared to Vonage, and absolutely nothing about its finances or how many customers it has, but you're going to take the plunge anyway. Not really. Regarding reliability, my new provider just had a data center crash the other day and my service never blinked. It rolled over to the backup center in maybe two minutes -- that more than meets my requirement of a ten minute maximum downtime.
Things fail, but I'm confident that my provider's backup system works because I was there when it was tested. THAT is much better than my experiences in the early days of Vonage (multi-hour blackouts).
As for finances, well, let's just say that I certainly do know how Vonage's finances are doing, and that was one of the reasons I was thinking of moving.
said by WAVZuser :I guess Vonage got too boring for you, so you need adventure.  Well, if you spell "boring" e-x-p-e-n-s-i-v-e and "adventure" v-a-l-u-e, then yes, exactly!
said by WAVZuser :I hope it works out for you. Please keep us updated. I will! So far, so good, but it's early in the day.
If things don't work out with my current provider I'll certainly not hesitate to move again. My next-up service would be CallCentric, I think. They have about the best reputation in the business, with long term reliability second to none. I'm hoping (and I think it's a reasonable expectation) that my new provider will meet those standards, but time will tell. |
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garys_2k
join:2004-05-07
Farmington, MI
·Future Nine Corpor..
·Vonage
| reply to strange_69
said by strange_69 :I'm going to miss you Gary. Please IM me and let me know what you find out. I'm staying but I need a back up for when that day comes. Thanks, Steve No problem! If you want to test some waters you can easily do it without changing a thing. That's what I did, "invest" in my own, unlocked, ATA (which I just programmed to give 5-1-1 road information for my state, a cool feature that costs nothing and took less than a minute).
Anyway, get a PAP2T-NA and there are a LOT of free choices you can test with. It's fun and, who knows, if you decide you want to make a change it's VERY easy.
Oh, I also wanted to say that Vonage was FINE with the port out! Once it was complete they canceled the account with NO intervention needed from my part. |
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arctangent
join:2003-11-13
Brooklyn, NY | reply to garys_2k
Who is your new provider? |
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mahermusic
join:2001-07-06
Chesterfield, NJ
·Vonage
 ·Comcast
| reply to garys_2k
said by garys_2k :Vonage is priced below POTS but just about at the price point of cable VOIP -- Huh?
Vonage for me $17
Cable (Comcast) is $45
Yikes... get this man a new calculator.
--
1/20/09 = The final day of our Retarded Cowboy President! |
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PX Eliezer
Premium
join:2008-08-09
New Jersey
·Optimum Voice
·callwithus
·voip.ms
·Callcentric
| Isn't that for the limited Vonage plan?
"Vonage Residential Basic 500 Minute Plan: 17.99"
And what fees are added to that?
Vonage's regular plan is 24.99 plus fees which does compare to cable company phone packages (especially with triple play discounts). |
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garys_2k
join:2004-05-07
Farmington, MI
·Future Nine Corpor..
·Vonage
| reply to mahermusic
said by mahermusic :said by garys_2k :Vonage is priced below POTS but just about at the price point of cable VOIP -- Huh? Vonage for me $17 Cable (Comcast) is $45 Yikes... get this man a new calculator. My Vonage's limited 500 minute plan came to about $23.50/month after all of the taxes and fees. Around here the cable co's advertise their phone service's teaser rate at about ~$29 per month, plus taxes and fees. That's awfully close to Vonage's $25 advertised rate.
Anyway, neither is competitive with other VOIP providers -- that's where really better value can be found these days (imho). |
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Mediocrates
join:2008-05-27
Raleigh, NC
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Vonage
·AT&T CallVantage
| reply to garys_2k
My Vonage unlimited (5000 mins a month actually) is the stated price on the website + about $3 in junk fees and stupid taxes. I really have absolutely nothing to complain about compared to say, AT&T CallVantage.
The only thing that comes close cost-wise is a Sprint Airave femtocell (via the Samsung device they sell) the service costs $5/month to access the service + $15/month to open it up to specific phones for unlimited minutes while anchored to the femtocell Airave device. A device I would add can be attached to ANY broadband port ANYWHERE in the US. |
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watts3000
join:2002-01-21
Birmingham, AL | What problem did you have with callvantage I've had them for almost 5 years an I've never had any problems out of them. I hate to see them go under |
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WAVZuser
join:2006-08-19
| reply to garys_2k
It's not fair to compare Vonage's regular price with cable's promotional prices.
Vonage is $25 a month plus fees and taxes for unlimited, stand-alone service. That's the most you'll ever pay. Cable can be as cheap as that (plus higher taxes and fees than with Vonage) for a limited time only and when bundled with other services from the same company. The regular price of cable phone is generally in the $40-45 range, and you still have to have your internet service with the same company.
Vonage also offers discounts. As of January, they were willing to give as much as a $10/month discount for a year to customers trying to cancel.
As far as comparing Vonage to other non-cable VoIP providers, there's no one to compare them to. Their closest competitor (Packet 8) only has 4% as many customers as they do. |
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mahermusic
join:2001-07-06
Chesterfield, NJ
·Vonage
·Comcast
| reply to garys_2k
said by garys_2k :said by mahermusic :said by garys_2k :Vonage is priced below POTS but just about at the price point of cable VOIP -- Huh? Vonage for me $17 Cable (Comcast) is $45 Yikes... get this man a new calculator. My Vonage's limited 500 minute plan came to about $23.50/month after all of the taxes and fees. Around here the cable co's advertise their phone service's teaser rate at about ~$29 per month, plus taxes and fees. That's awfully close to Vonage's $25 advertised rate. Anyway, neither is competitive with other VOIP providers -- that's where really better value can be found these days (imho). TEASER rate is correct.... It's not even close when your TEASER rate goes bye-bye... If your goal is to pay more for less, you're on the right track! I'll stick with Vonage, and pay less, for more.
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1/20/09 = The final day of our Retarded Cowboy President! |
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garys_2k
join:2004-05-07
Farmington, MI
·Future Nine Corpor..
·Vonage
| reply to WAVZuser
said by WAVZuser :It's not fair to compare Vonage's regular price with cable's promotional prices. Vonage is $25 a month plus fees and taxes for unlimited, stand-alone service. That's the most you'll ever pay. Cable can be as cheap as that (plus higher taxes and fees than with Vonage) for a limited time only and when bundled with other services from the same company. The regular price of cable phone is generally in the $40-45 range, and you still have to have your internet service with the same company. Vonage also offers discounts. As of January, they were willing to give as much as a $10/month discount for a year to customers trying to cancel. As far as comparing Vonage to other non-cable VoIP providers, there's no one to compare them to. Their closest competitor (Packet 8) only has 4% as many customers as they do. I'm not sure what difference it makes re. how many lines each company has, in total, to a single person's needs. So I don't count size, unless that relates positively to an attribute that's actually important, e.g. reliability. And reliability doesn't scale with number of users, it's more dependent on redundancy and back end failover systems.
For me, in my case, Vonage's price just wasn't competitive any more. I use 3-400 minutes/month, occasionally going up to 500 or so. We don't use some of the cool features (like have non-local friends or relatives use their out of town "local" numbers to avoid long distance), but I absolutely agree that could be a HUGE benefit for a whole bunch of people.
My new provider costs me 1¢ per minute of use, plus $5 per month for the incoming line, plus another $1 per month for E911. So, that usually works out to $10/month, total, if we use 400 minutes.
But YMMV! If you really take advantage of some of the features, then Vonage may certainly be the best bet for anyone. As I said in my first post here, what counts, plus and minus, to me may have no bearing on another person's decision. |
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PX Eliezer
Premium
join:2008-08-09
New Jersey | That is a very thoughtful and well-reasoned analysis.
Every customer differs as to usage patterns, requirements, priorities, and goals. |
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Mediocrates
join:2008-05-27
Raleigh, NC
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Vonage
·AT&T CallVantage
| reply to garys_2k
Watts3000 -
I had innumerable problems with CV. I still have one CV business line paid for by my company, paid direct, no bill comes to me. It uses an old Centillium MTA-1 and it's servicable enough for what it does. The problems really only erupted when I tried to get a second line on a second account using a second TA. This proved to be impossible. Neither line worked, the DLink 5102-S for the second line was horrible unstable junk. I could never get the new second line to operate at all. Inbound calls to each of the numbers went to the wrong TA more than half the time.
In fact the problems were so severe I terminated service on the new line within 3 weeks of having purchased it. That line went to Vonage and both lines have been fine since. It's quite remarkable, in my mind that CV does a better job coexisting with another VoIP provider on the same cable hookup than it does with itself.
This is not to say that the service on the old CV line was bad. It's not. I don't like the E911 broadcast message and the feature set with the service is somewhat limited but it works well otherwise. When AT&T pulls the plug on CV soon, and it will, it will be unfortunate and will require me to replace it with a service and that will require me to do more babysitting, expense submissions, configuration and so on. Which - considering it's 'just' a phone, does not thrill me. |
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MotoVT
Vonage User Since Jan 2004
join:2002-12-03
Butler, PA | reply to garys_2k
Who did you go with? Sorry to see you leave Vonage. I've been watching their cash flow and I'm prepared to use Armstrong phone service if they go under.
Stick around and post off and on ok? |
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garys_2k
join:2004-05-07
Farmington, MI
·Future Nine Corpor..
·Vonage
| said by MotoVT :Who did you go with? Sorry to see you leave Vonage. I've been watching their cash flow and I'm prepared to use Armstrong phone service if they go under. Stick around and post off and on ok? Hey, Moto! Long time, man!
I went with Future Nine -- they're smaller (who isn't?), but have been around for a year and have some bulletproof backup equipment. Nitzan, their prez, hangs out in the tech chat here and answers a lot of questions. So far so good!
How are those Uniden phones? |
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MotoVT
Vonage User Since Jan 2004
join:2002-12-03
Butler, PA
| AH man now who are we gonna spar with about Vonage? I'm still hanging in there with them. I'll probably stick around to the very end. Still running the Moto box as is my dad. Mom passed away in 07 so he's managing it on his own. He too has the moto box, no issues unless Communistcast is experiencing service problems.
The unidens are chugging along. Just replaced the batteries in both as the use time was way shorter than when new. Now they work like champs.
Honestly, I would probably lose Vonage and go strictly mobile were it not for relatives in Europe, SE Asia, and the mid east. Vonage is the most cost effective for me to call them or have them call me. Recently upgraded my mobile to a Samsung model. The 4 year old Moto v180 gave up the ghost finally!
Stay in touch.
--
Uniden TRU8885 5.8 ghz phone
Recruiting people to give up POTS and switch to VOIP
Netgear WGT624 Wireless router |
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ednj
join:2001-03-09
Hillsborough, NJ
·Comcast
·Patriot Media
| reply to garys_2k
I've been a Vonage customer for four years and most of the time it's been reliable (except for two years ago when there were major problems). Anyway, Comcast made me a Triple Play offer that came to less than I was currently paying for Vonage plus the Comcast HSI/HDTV+HBO package that I had. I'll be saving $15 per month for the first 12 months. After that the savings will be less but still lower than what I would be paying for Vonage with the HSI/HDTV+HBO. Aside from cost, Comcast DV offers somewhat higher reliability and voice clarity than an independent VOIP provider. Comcast's DV uses a separate channel that does not interfere with the HSI. Of course there is also the issue of Vonage's financial situation which has been an ongoing concern. |
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